ADHD Meets the Budget Nerds: Give Every Dollar with a Job with Ben and Ernie

ADHD Money

Sep 18

Money and ADHD: two words that often stir up stress, shame, or avoidance. But what if we stopped thinking of planning as punishment and instead saw it as a path to clarity, confidence, and even peace of mind? This week, Pete and Nikki welcome Ben Barlowe and Ernie Reppe—the Budget Nerds of YNAB—to talk about why the word budgeting is going out of style and how we’re still all-in on the money mindset.

They share how to build a money mindset that’s about purpose, not restriction, and why giving every dollar a job is the simple shift that makes all the difference. From impulse spending and forgotten bills to shame spirals and the fear of facing financial reality, this conversation gets real about the unique challenges ADHD brings to money management—and how to take the sting out of them.

Whether you’re brand new to planning your finances or you’ve tried before and burned out, this is your invitation to make peace with your money and take back control.

Links & Notes

Pete Wright
Hello, everybody, and welcome to Taking Control, the ADHD podcast on TruStory FM. I'm Pete Wright, and I'm here with Nikki Kinzer.
Nikki Kinzer
Hello everyone. Hello, Pete Wright.
Pete Wright
Nikki, I got a little riled up in the pre-show.
Nikki Kinzer
You did.
Pete Wright
And so my energy is high right now, but I'm
Nikki Kinzer
It is high.
Pete Wright
I'm so excited for this conversation for so many reasons. We are continuing our series about uh finance and ADHD. When I got riled up last week about side hustles, uh, that was
Nikki Kinzer
Oh
Pete Wright
unpleasant for everybody. Uh so today we're gonna talk about we were gonna talk about budgeting, but I have it on good authority that that word is now sort of verboten. And so We have to I have to learn why I'm not gonna use that word anymore. And I'm very excited to do it. We have the budget nerds here. We're gonna get to them in just a second. But first, you know the drill. Head over to take controladh. com and get to know us a little bit better. You can listen to the show right there on the website or subscribe to the mailing list. We'll send you an email each time a new episode is released. You can find us on the socials, Facebook, Instagram, Pinterest, Blue Sky at take control ADHD, and we would love to see you in the Discord. server take control adhd. com slash discord there are a lot of people over there now y'all and they are all living their best life with adh learning from one another supporting one another it is incredibly gratifying to see that community grow and thrive. A lot of them over there are members of our Patreon community, so they get access to the Triple Secret channels. And you can join and become a member there at patreon. com slash the ADHD podcast. Uh as you know, the economy is doing great. But if you want to help us do great through this great economy, then you could join Patreon, get access to those channels, get new a access to new episodes. Uh uh A week before they're released, before everybody else hears them, you get access to all kinds of other uh special events. We're very, very excited to offer all those things to you. Check it out. Patreon. com slash the ADHD podcast to learn more. Today, we are continuing our conversation about ADHD and money. Do you hear how serious I got when I started talking about ADHD and money?
Nikki Kinzer
Yes
Pete Wright
Very serious.
Ben Barlowe
Very serious.
Pete Wright
For most of us with ADHD, the word alone can bring up a mix of emotion. Stress, avoidance, shame. But here's the truth: planning doesn't have to be about restriction or punishment. It can actually be a tool for clarity, confidence, and even a little peace of mind. To help us explore how, we are joined by two of our favorite budget nerds from YNAB, Ben Barlowe and Ernie Reppe. Ernie, is it Repi?
Ernie Reppe
It is well done.
Pete Wright
I have never a thank you.
Ben Barlowe
You got it right.
Pete Wright
I had to guess because you guys never say your last names on the show.
Ben Barlowe
It's true.
Ernie Reppe
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
I well I only like very recently learned how to say Ernie's last name.
Pete Wright
Yeah
Ben Barlowe
With ver like we don't we don't ever talk about our last names. We only go by first name.
Pete Wright
Five years you've been doing the show together.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
And we've been working together for nine.
Ben Barlowe
We never
Pete Wright
Okay.
Ben Barlowe
Well, I like it was only like this year.
Pete Wright
Oh my goodness.
Ben Barlowe
I was like, oh it's Repi.
Pete Wright
It's Repi.
Ben Barlowe
I thought it was Rep.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
But yeah, now I know.
Pete Wright
Ben, I'm glad I could teach you something here today. Repi. Uh Ernie Repi. They have spent years teaching people how to bring more purpose and flexibility into their financial lives, and today they're here to share their wisdom with us. Don't worry, they're not here to tell us what we can or can't buy. They might try. but probably won't. They are here to show us how this simple framework can help us feel more in control of where our money is going and less weighed down by where it's been. Ben and Ernie, formerly at long last, welcome to the ADHD Podcast.
Ben Barlowe
Thank you, what a intro. I appreciate that.
Ernie Reppe
Yeah, thank you very much. Excited to be here.
Pete Wright
Well, it's very timely. Nikki, you don't know this, but as a subscriber to of their show, I have to tell you that just seven days ago they released an episode.
Nikki Kinzer
Oh yes,
Pete Wright
in which i they talk all about getting started with YNAB and putting a lot of the men the the sort of the mentality, the money mindset at work. And it's really fun to watch how hard it is for Ben not to get super nerdy about it. Ernie has the reins and Ben
Ben Barlowe
Ernie was holding me back.
Pete Wright
Oh my God. It is a delightful, delightful thing. So I'm going to put that episode particular, in particular, in the show notes for people because and it's really great to watch on YouTube.
Ben Barlowe
Perfect.
Pete Wright
It's You you know, there's there's a lot you can do with theater of the mind, but watching the screen share is really, really good. Okay. You guys are not ADHD experts, and I have it on some authority. that you might have had some anxiety about coming on an ADHD podcast.
Ernie Reppe
Yes.
Ben Barlowe
Well, I didn't want to come in and be like, so I know everything about your brain. Because I don't.
Pete Wright
Yeah. Luckily, uh, we've got that part covered. We're really okay.
Ben Barlowe
God
Nikki Kinzer
Yep.
Pete Wright
I think I think what we what we want to get to is this is is just to talk a little bit about first why it's okay to come to terms with the fact that money can be harder with ADHD and you know the things that that we deal with maybe in large part more than neuronormative folks. uh i i around impulse spending and forgetting bills and shame spirals around inconsistency, right? All of those kinds of things. uh get in the way of us with ADHD and Nikki I know the people you work with are are living those those things huge
Nikki Kinzer
Oh yeah, this is a huge topic. Yeah, I would say with the ADHD, it's definitely the impulsiveness, you know, of buying things before thinking, not being able to have that pause button.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Um but also uh uh keeping a budget feels really big. And so and then not sure how to break that down into a smaller piece, and so then there's avoidance that just doesn't happen. And so, you know, hoping that there's money in the bank or hoping that there's enough credit to cover something Um, but then in taxes. I mean, I have a lot of clients who uh don't do their taxes or they're um they're late by the, you know, they're always extending. to the tax deadline because they've waited to the last minute uh to do taxes. And then it's so stressful to be able to get all that paperwork together. And then there I know some people who've gone years, you know. Um, so yeah, I think that some of those things are just with ADHD, it it heightens it. I but I I don't want to say that that doesn't happen with neurotypical neurotypical people either. Like I know that happens with with those folks as well. So they're not alone, but I think that's just escalated a little bit.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Pete Wright
Well and and so I turn to you guys. The uh like is in in our efforts to kind of normalize the fact that these are common challenges with everybody Um you've been talking about budgeting for together for a long time. You're trainers at Winab. You've been at Winab for a long time. Give us a little bit of background uh as to how you landed. in the place where you've landed to become teachers of this stuff.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, Ernie wanna go first.
Ernie Reppe
I was a customer first. So I found Wineab thirteen years ago
Pete Wright
Oh, I love that.
Ernie Reppe
And I just I fell in love with it. Like I loved the software. And I think I loved it because it worked.
Pete Wright
And I think I want to make a lot of three lines.
Ernie Reppe
Like I saw big differences with my money. And then I just ended up loving the company, the culture, the vibe. And I'm like, man, I want to be a part of this someday. And it just so happened I was uh at the end of my rope in this dead end job, and I'm like, I need to change. And so I saw that WineApp was posting seasonal positions. And this was for the support team during our busy season, which is December and January. And I'm like, I'm going to take a shot at this. It's a temporary position, but if I can get my foot in the door. Maybe something can work out. And sure enough, it did. So I was hired as a seasonal. I came on part-time permanent. And then I went permanent full-time and then eventually I transitioned to the marketing team where I became a teacher and one half of the budget nerd show.
Nikki Kinzer
I love that.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, there you go.
Pete Wright
I I love that is a that's one of those aspirational stories. And it's I love it so much because we have m members on the ADHD team. that actually started as members of our fantastic community.
Ben Barlowe
Oh, that's awesome.
Pete Wright
I just I think that's the best way. That's the best way to find a place you love.
Ernie Reppe
Yeah, yeah.
Pete Wright
It's aspirational.
Ernie Reppe
And and what I love about that story too, to to bring it back to money is Winab helped me make that jump because when I transitioned from that full-time job, I was taking a big pay cut.
Pete Wright
Sure.
Ernie Reppe
But looking at the numbers, I'm like, okay, this is it's gonna be a little bit tighter, but It's feasible. I can do this based on what I have planned out with my money.
Pete Wright
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Uh we're gonna talk more about that. Ben, tell us your story.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, mine's pretty similar actually. Uh I I was also a customer way back in 2013. I was had first baby on the way, and I was like, I need to figure something out here, you know, because I need to save all this money for uh maternity leave as my wife is gonna stop working for a little while and and uh we you know, just all the medical bills and everything. So we we were looking for things. I was always I always used a budget in some form. I used mint back in the day. But it just wasn't like I I wanted to really lock in. And so I wanted to look for something else. And And that's when I found Wineab. And I was always a little bit of a personal finance nerd, but when I found Wineab, it got like I got real into it. And it's like its own thing. You know what I mean? Like I was within a couple years, I was like on our we have like a huge subreddit that's all fan-led.
Pete Wright
Like I was in a challenge.
Ben Barlowe
I was like in there teaching people and I was like, no, like this is the way. You gotta do it this way, you know, and and I remember I was also like Ernie, I was I was also in a bit of a career crisis. I was I was working in a in a library, which was good, but like I I I I was just kind of getting blocked on like career paths. And I was like, what do I want to do? I remember what my wife asked me. This was like January 2016. She was like, hey, if you could do anything at all, like don't even worry about money, like, what would it be? And I said, well, what I'd really love to do is teach for Wineab. But that's never gonna happen.
Nikki Kinzer
That's not a job.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. Yeah. And then I kid you not, uh so I started looking into like uh financial coaching and different things like that.
Nikki Kinzer
So
Ben Barlowe
So I kind of was on a career journey like moving that direction. And then in October that year, a job, a teaching job at WyNeb. came up and it was a part-time job uh teaching workshops because we uh Ernie still does workshops all the time today and we do uh we do all these
Pete Wright
Unbelievable. Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
webinars and they're awesome. And I applied and I got it. And it was the dream come true. It was exactly what I wanted. Right.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And ever since then, been doing it, got hired full time a year year later, doing I've done anything you can think of in marketing, I've done it. Yeah, why not?
Pete Wright
Sure.
Ben Barlowe
So I've done all sorts of stuff. Yeah, and then about five years ago we started the um um the Budget Nerds podcast because Ernie came on the bargaining team and we wanted to have him some give him something to do.
Ernie Reppe
Seriously.
Pete Wright
Man.
Ben Barlowe
Like that was that was it. Um And we were like, you know, we don't have a ton of content like for like the season hardcore wineabbers. And that was the original idea. And so we we were like, what what better name than than budget nerds? And we we went with that. And now it's such a huge community. And um it's not it's not just season white nappers, it's new folks too.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
So it's been really, really powerful, really fun.
Nikki Kinzer
Damn.
Pete Wright
Well, we we found Wynnum.
Nikki Kinzer
That's great.
Pete Wright
Chelsea Brennan of Smart Money Mamas came on the show some years ago. and said some very kind things about Winab. And that we, I mean, neither of us uh had ever explored Winab. Um and and was still lamenting the acquisition of Mint by Intuit.
Ben Barlowe
Right, right.
Pete Wright
Like that was those were some very sad days.
Ben Barlowe
That was a moment in time, yeah.
Pete Wright
Yeah. Um, and uh I think it was shortly after that that uh we started just kind of playing with it, toying with it, and it became so quickly core to how I manage my business and personal finances, uh, that we had Jesse on the show. And we'll put that link in the show notes too, because he was fantastic.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah
Pete Wright
um and and talked about sort of how uh how he got started with the company or or how he got the company started. And gave us the four rules of YNAB. Now, I'm my understanding is there's now one rule of YNAB. So
Ben Barlowe
We've changed it up a little bit, yeah.
Pete Wright
You've changed it up a little bit. So what I'm hoping we can do here for the our first major educational segment, coaches, uh is to talk about setting up the budgeting mentality, right? What is it? that is that goes into the budgeting mindset shift, right? Budgeting not for restriction, but for clarity and and choice. Right? How do you lead newbies through that process?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, well I'll say the first thing, the core of our method for planning your spending, for for handling your money. is give every dollar a job. And that is that's what you do in YNAB. You know, a lot of folks like to um use a an envelope analogy. And I think that's really probably the best analogy for what you're doing in WyNab. We have all these categories in Wineab. And imagine it like paper envelopes where you're just putting all the cash on the table and you're stuffing it, you know, money into a groceries envelope or into an electric bill envelope, right? You're just putting money into these things and you spend out of that envelope, right? This is like your grandma did this back in like the 60s, right?
Pete Wright
Classic envelope budgeting, yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Right? That's what Wineab is. But we don't use cash because that's the worst. I mean, like, you know.
Nikki Kinzer
It's dirty, it's yeah.
Ben Barlowe
I mean, I mean I mean if if you wanna if you wanna put some some cash in an envelope and do that, like I think you're awesome, but like
Pete Wright
Dirty, filthy money.
Ben Barlowe
You know, it's it's 2025, so we we digitize that. That's that's basically what we're doing. We're we're digitizing this this cash on So when you give every dollar a job, what you're doing is you're putting that money in an envelope. You're just giving it a purpose and you're planning how you're going to spend your money before you actually spend your money. Right. And uh that's the core part of the method. And then we have a bunch of teaching on how to how to do that. But that's that's the the basic idea right there.
Ernie Reppe
And a key piece in all of this, and this is I think where the mindset shift happens, is you're only working with the money that you have.
Ben Barlowe
Mm-hmm.
Ernie Reppe
You're not forecasting any of those future paychecks. So what that practically does for people is it gives meaning to your bank balance. Here's this big blob of money, and maybe it's this abstract amount, but I'm gonna make that concrete. I'm gonna break that big total of money or small total, whatever the case is. into these smaller piles of very distinct jobs. And once that clicked with me and once it's clicked with other wineabbers, it feels like that becomes a game changer.
Pete Wright
I I I I want to have you reflect on this idea that I think a lot of people who are new to budgeting or or m you know planning their money struggle with, which is the the idea of building a budget that is really based on past spending versus building a budget that's based on future or current or future jobs or needs, right? Can you talk a little bit about that?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, 'cause that's what most people think of when you say say the B word, you say budgeting, right?
Pete Wright
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
Uh and it's kind of a bummer because Yeah, and usually what it is is like you you just categorize your expenses, your transactions, right? Or it's done for you automatically with software or whatever, and then you get like a report at the end of the the month and you see how much you screwed up, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah
Ben Barlowe
And so, right.
Pete Wright
Exactly.
Ben Barlowe
And so it's just, yeah, it's this shame, it's this shame-based system.
Pete Wright
Shame spiral. Right.
Ben Barlowe
And like, I do think it can be effective. Like it's better than nothing because at least you say, oh, you know. I spent too much more or mi or more than I wanted to at least in this category. So maybe I can try to rein that in. But it's not there's not like a real causal connection. Like the the only thing that's causing you to Change your behavior is just this this shame, really. Uh is like, look how bad you did, and you get that report at the end.
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
But what we're doing here is instead of that, we're actually planning ahead. By giving every dollar a job. And that way you have a guide going forward. So when I want to go out to eat I can look at my dining out category and see how much real dollars are are in that category available to spend. And they are connected to reality because we only give ever we only give money. We we only give jobs to dollars that we actually have in the bank. It represents real money, right? And so then I can make decisions. If I look and I see, oh, I don't have um any money in the dining out category. I could I can make the decision to say, no, I'm not going to go out to eat right now because I'm but you can actually see why. You can look at your category and say, well, the reason why I'm not going out to eat right now is because I'm going after these other goals. Or You could say, you know what, I really do want to go out to you right now, but I don't have money for it. Let's take some money from an another category, move cash out of another envelope and bring it into this dining out envelope. And then I know exactly what I gave up. It makes it super tangible and super real, right? Instead of this like vibe of, uh, I just screwed up. I guess I have to do better next month, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Can I just say something too? Like I think that that's such an important value when you're a parent to teach your kids. Because that is something that we did growing as they were growing up. They're adults now. But um when we would be at the grocery store, for example some you know one of them might say well can I have this and I'd be like no we only have enough money for our groceries so we can't get that oh okay and they can't they can't argue if you don't have the money
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Pete Wright
And they can't think at a heart, but I don't think it might look great, right?
Ben Barlowe
Right, right.
Nikki Kinzer
Right? Like they they can't th they don't have the the mindset to say, well let's take let's take the apples away and we can bring the candy in.
Pete Wright
They they can't they don't have that mindset how people let them like example away and bring it into anyway.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Nikki Kinzer
But anyway, I just want to say that that, you know, when you've got children, it's such a good way to kind of get them thinking about money too.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, I I I I wrote I wrote this vlog like a years ago.
Nikki Kinzer
So on a side note.
Ben Barlowe
My my son, he's eight now, but he was only two years old. And he came up to me.
Pete Wright
They can uh uh we'll go uh.
Ben Barlowe
I was like sitting in the, I remember so vividly, I was like sitting in the front yard. He was running around. And he came up and he said, I want some blue cream. He wants blue ice cream. That's what he said. He said in that exact voice. And I looked, I was like, oh, I was like, if we could go out to ice cream. And I looked at my wine up. I looked at the entertainment category and there wasn't any money there. Um, it was like the end of the month, and I was just like running on fumes a little bit here. And And you know, and so I I just I I just like showed him he's two, okay? I showed him I was like, look, there's there's no money in there, like there's a zero. I you know, he didn't he didn't know what's going on, but I like showed him anyway and I was like, We don't have any money for that right now. And he was like, then we won't go.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, plus his heart.
Pete Wright
Oh that you can
Ben Barlowe
And I was expecting him to be I was expecting him to be upset, but he was just like, oh yeah, well we'll do it. W
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, okay, yeah, yeah
Ben Barlowe
And then he's ran off and played.
Pete Wright
Yeah, then it was gone.
Ben Barlowe
And so it was really cool. Yeah. And that was gone. And then but like later, now that they're older I am having conversations with them because they have their little category and I say, like, well, hey, the conversations like, hey, you can go do this thing, you can you can buy that toy or whatever it is. But if you do that, you won't be able to do this. Um, so it's just it's it's it's and it's not shame-based.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
It's not like, hey, if you buy that toy, you're a bad person. It's just what do you want? You I have to grapple with the truth that you don't you only have so much money, you can only do so much. And so instead of saying, hey, we're not gonna buy this toy because you're you're a jerk if you buy the toy or you're uh uh you should feel ashamed of it. Instead we say, uh, well we can buy that toy, but that means we can't do this. So which one of these two things do you value more? And so it really it just becomes instead of this shame spiral thing. It's just asking, what do I want? Like what do I want my life to look like? And asking yourself that over and over and over again.
Pete Wright
Oh my god, I believe that we do that down to the background and
Ben Barlowe
And then in that process, your spending actually lines up with who you want to be. And it's really powerful.
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm.
Pete Wright
The uh so everything you're describing here sound sounds a lot like the original Four Rules of Wineab.
Ben Barlowe
Yes
Pete Wright
I as a as a longtime lover of the Four Rules. And ha as I got the email yesterday from uh our your colleague Brittany telling me, you know, we don't really use the four rules anymore
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, yeah.
Pete Wright
Um I you're changing it up.
Ben Barlowe
We we're changing up.
Pete Wright
And I'm curious w um sort of where that comes from because I think, you know, we've we've been talking with our community about the four rules when we talk about these things, and it sounds like you're still using some of the language around that, but I'd like to know how this evolution for you in the way you talk about th money mentality. um has evolved people's success with money living, right? We used to have
Ben Barlowe
Mm-hmm.
Pete Wright
Give every dollar a job. You've already said that. You you dropped that, so drink. Um, but the other three rules, right? Embrace true expenses, roll with the punches, and age your money. Like all of those things were kind of central to what WineEbb was. And now they're we're not talking about those so much. So uh how has this simplification helped people think about their money more positively?
Ernie Reppe
I think it's more palatable now. You you don't have to do as much explaining because what are true expenses?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
We have a boxing metaphor in there. You know, if you're not a sports person like what? Age of money. Like honestly, can can a hardcore wine ever describe age of money?
Pete Wright
I've uh I don't mind the colours.
Ernie Reppe
So and and also we realized all the rules, it's basically one rule. It's give every dollar a job. And so what we transitioned to are questions because we realized in in helping millions of people with their money. They know the answers. Like we don't know what to tell them. They know their lives best. And so we're just going to offer them questions, things for them to consider, and they can give the answers.
Pete Wright
Hm.
Ben Barlowe
So we can go over those questions.
Pete Wright
Okay.
Ben Barlowe
You'll see.
Pete Wright
Yeah. They're all there, right?
Ben Barlowe
It's repackaged a little bit.
Pete Wright
That's I feel like I need you to give me a safety b like a some sort of a a stuffed animal or something.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's it's actually exactly the same principles.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
It's just more plain language. And also we we swi we shifted it from rules, which is more Again, a little more shamey based to, hey, let's just let's just ask you questions. So we could go over those questions if you want.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, let's do it.
Pete Wright
Yes, ple let's do it.
Ben Barlowe
All right. Well the first question is what does this money need to do before I'm paid again? And I think for folks with ADHD who are like struggling with making things concrete. This is huge. So this is what when you deal with just the reality of your regular expenses. Um, you only and it it's and what I love, it's very concrete. It's like look at the money you have right now. Look at the money and and you do this every time you get paid. So whenever you get paid, ask yourself, what does this money, the money I have right now, need to do before I get paid again? And so you have a time frame, you have an amount, and you just look at it. So if I have uh my mortgage or my rent that's due before my next paycheck, I gotta take care of that. So I'll put money there, right? And so you just you look at what's coming up between now and your next paycheck, put money aside, easy peasy, right?
Nikki Kinzer
So one of the things that you need to know is what's coming up, right?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, that's true.
Nikki Kinzer
So that's something that I think like the ADHD year may miss. So we need to know what our expenses are.
Ben Barlowe
Mm-hmm. Yeah, listen out your expenses are the the I think really the first step.
Pete Wright
Yeah, let's know that because we're not going to be a good one.
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
And you know, we do that in categories in Wineab and there's all these
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm. It's beautiful, yes.
Ben Barlowe
Software features to help you with it.
Pete Wright
Oh, we're gonna talk about that.
Ben Barlowe
It's makes it fun.
Nikki Kinzer
It's so easy, yeah.
Pete Wright
Just put a pin in that.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
All right, go ahead.
Pete Wright
Okay.
Ben Barlowe
And then when you go beyond that, the next question is, okay, what larger or less frequent spending do I need to prepare for? So I've looked at like maybe the next two weeks. Now I want to look up a little more and say, okay, what's coming up? And this is analogous to embrace your true expenses. This is What are some non-monthly things that happen? Like uh like the car repairs. Like you don't know when it's gonna happen, you don't know how much, but you know you do know it's gonna be more than zero dollars. So So set set aside more than zero dollars at least, right?
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
So set money aside for that, set money aside for um a yearly subscription to a software service or something like that, right? Um what you're doing is you're kind of like taking these large Uh, things that sneak up on you because they don't happen every month, and breaking them down in monthly amounts. It's like you're just doing like these monthly subscriptions and you're setting money aside in these categories so that when the card does break down, you have cash. to handle it. And it's you just feel like so awesome when it happens, right?
Pete Wright
Oh God, yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah.
Pete Wright
Right. Okay. I I love that, and I think the This is that that's something very powerful. The one that sticks with me is embrace your true expenses, right?
Ben Barlowe
Mm-hmm, mm.
Pete Wright
Because that's one I still keep in my head. a lot that the things that you know that it and I guess it's the artifact from um sort of budgeting like old school, like let's look at what we spent, that is still in my head as an old person, I guess.
Ben Barlowe
Totally, yeah
Pete Wright
Uh that that that I still feel like I have to to keep and I have to have resonant and uh every time I sit down and and look at my budget. Um What is the what is your current mindset around true expenses when you're talking to people who struggle with figuring out their true expenses?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, that's a good question. Well the reason why we switched from the the true expenses language is just so it's plainly clear right at the beginning.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Like instead of saying true expenses, and here's what the concept of true expenses is, right? Now we just say, what are your larger, less frequent
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Expenses or your non-monthly expenses, right?
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And so as you people get, especially that word non-monthly, people just get it like right away, right?
Pete Wright
Okay.
Ben Barlowe
So uh I think that's yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
It's the quarterly payment of like insurance or something like that, right?
Pete Wright
Oh I still ha no, I still have the stuff I forgot to budget for category.
Nikki Kinzer
Like that's yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, I think that's a good idea too, because there's there's always gonna be things that you forget.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah.
Pete Wright
Yeah. Always things.
Ben Barlowe
I mean, uh always, right? It's just it's always a thing. So Yeah, so it's just things that tend to sni like in the in in the past you, they tend to sneak up on you because they're not here right in front of your face. They don't happen every month. But if you look up and you plan for it by setting money aside for it. Yeah, I mean you'll just feel so cool because you'll have money for those things. Like you know how it is, Pete, right?
Pete Wright
Oh yeah.
Ben Barlowe
You're just like, yo yeah, I got the money for it.
Pete Wright
Oh yeah, oh yeah.
Ben Barlowe
I get the the the sound of the mechanic's voice When they call you and they say, Oh yeah, it's gonna you know, they the worst part of their job where they have to tell you that you owe two thousand dollars, you know, for this thing and you just say, Oh, okay, that's fine.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And they're just like, What? Like, oh
Pete Wright
Oh, really?
Ben Barlowe
It's like I feel I feel I feel like I'm like helping myself, but I'm also helping the mechanic and making his job easier.
Pete Wright
It's okay. I can I can eat tonight, says the mechanic.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
Right? It's just so much better.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
So yeah. Um
Ernie Reppe
And I think a practical piece of advice here in in talking about like what what about the person who struggles to think through what all their true expenses actually are?
Pete Wright
Uh Yes.
Ernie Reppe
It does not have to be perfect out of the gate.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
You know, my first year, it took me one full year to fully figure out what my true expenses were. And so for that first year. I relied heavily on the stuff I forgot category.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
And you can continue to rely on that however long it takes. Maybe five years down the road, you're like, hey, I haven't been using that. I've I've maybe kind of dialed these in by now. But so just give yourself permission to take it easy. It doesn't have to be perfect out of the gate.
Pete Wright
Yeah, yeah, smart.
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. I mean your your plan is a living it's a living breathing thing because you're and and you're always gonna be changing it because your life is always changing and your values are always changing and It should reflect that, right? So don't feel like, oh, if I get if I forget one, I'm I'm a monster. You know, you you can you can roll with the punches when the tongue comes, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
I said it. I said the boxing metaphor.
Pete Wright
Drink. Uh so So this is the thing this is the thing that I feel like I do at the end of every month. I'm rolling with the punches actively. I'm saying, oh, I overspend a couple of categories. I'm gonna take from some categories that I'm not spending right now. I'm gonna just smooth things out so that I can make the credit card payment. And um and uh th th this is the experience of figuring out how to get myself back on track when my budget falls off the rails. And if we know anything with ADHD, it's the better the structure in our lives around any system, any process. The easier it will be to regain control when that process inevitably fails.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
It will fail. It will be harder to rebuild if you don't have a system in place.
Ben Barlowe
And not just a system, but like a system that that can handle flexible like it you can be flexible and you can make changes.
Pete Wright
Yes.
Ben Barlowe
Like if you have a really rigid system, it's just gonna break and you're gonna throw it away, right?
Pete Wright
Absolutely.
Ben Barlowe
But this system is is all about yeah, making those trade-off decisions and moving money between categories and And so long as you do it with your eyes wide open, you have all the information in front of you, you're gonna be out, you're gonna make good decisions.
Nikki Kinzer
Well, and I have to say as a new member when I first started with with Winehab
Pete Wright
That is
Nikki Kinzer
As m as intuitive as it is, I still think you need to like, you know, watch whatever tutorials you need to ask the questions that you need to. Because I screwed up and ha Oh, yeah
Ben Barlowe
Well, it's it's a different way of thinking about your money, it really is.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And so it's not just learning software, it's it's like it's like, oh my gosh, this is a whole different mindset, you know.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Absolutely. And I had to start all over.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, totally normal.
Nikki Kinzer
But you guys make it really easy to start over though
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, absolutely.
Nikki Kinzer
That's the other thing is it does make it really easy to start over. But I just uh yeah, I just have to say, you know, read the directions, people.
Pete Wright
I think breathe and do I think that's a good thing.
Nikki Kinzer
Don't think you could just figure it out because it gets complicated
Ben Barlowe
Ernie's got a video for you on our on our YouTube channel. He'll get he'll he'll teach you.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
I got a live workshop you can come to.
Ben Barlowe
He'll teach how to do it.
Pete Wright
I know a lot of workshops.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
That's right.
Nikki Kinzer
Absolutely, yeah, yeah.
Ben Barlowe
That's right. There that you are not alone. There are many, many up many stuff. There's a lot of content out there for you to learn.
Pete Wright
Yeah, yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah.
Ben Barlowe
So yeah.
Pete Wright
Well, I I think all of the things that we're talking about, right, they they're all about uh you know, removing the shame with reality. And sometimes reality causes sh like can trigger shame. But the whole idea for me is that when I am deeply in touch with my plan I have less shame and I'm more self-compassionate because I know I've done the work.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
And I I feel like that's that's really important. Let us start with just sort of plan zero. Um when you have new people coming to Wineab, where do they where do you suggest they start? Like give us some some small sort of realistic steps for beginners to just Get started. And I know that the first one is go watch Ernie's video. Subscribe to Budget Nerds. Like we get it. But just for people who are listening who are like, hey, I'm going to open Wineab right now. What's the first thing I should do? You also kind of thought about this on the episode I was just talking about. Do you link your accounts first? Do you enter your categories first? Let's let's hash it out. Where do you recommend people start?
Ernie Reppe
Keep it as simple as possible.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
So start with one checking account. That's probably your primary spend account right there. And then start with your categories. Just start customizing them. What what things do I know for sure that I spend my money on?
Pete Wright
What do you think what's you only have to go to the
Ernie Reppe
And then you don't have to go through bank statements. You don't have to try to recall everything you've spent over the past six months. As those things come up, you just create a new category.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
And that's it.
Pete Wright
And that's it. That's it.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. And then just every time you get paid, it's just it's just Do follow that process of giving every dollar a job and just put the money into categories and then follow the plan as you track that spending and You can move money between categories if you want.
Pete Wright
Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
That's a huge part of it. One of the questions is what changes do I need to make, if any? And you ask that all the time, right?
Pete Wright
Yeah, yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Well, I think that's such a an important message too for our audience to to hear is that
Pete Wright
I uh
Nikki Kinzer
It is it it is a simple method. We do not need to overcomplicate it.
Ben Barlowe
Right, right. Yeah, you can complicate it as much as you want. Like it like we did a we did a s starting simple episode, and I think later we're gonna do an advanced uh why why nav episode if you really want to get super nerdy and all the details, but But go ba I go back to that envelope analogy. That's all you're doing. You're just putting money in envelopes, spending out of those envelopes.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah
Ben Barlowe
That's really all you're doing. And so if you want to just start with that and don't even worry about all the nerdy software features that you can really get into, that's fine. Just start start nice and simple.
Ernie Reppe
And you know what you could even make this simpler than what we're talking about. You could add your checking account Link that account and just monitor your spending. Just look at your transactions.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
You don't even have to go into the categories or implement the YNAM method. Just start paying attention to what your spending is with no judgment. And then it just will naturally evolve from there. You'll just keep adding more and more until eventually you're gonna be a full-fledged budget nerd.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. Yeah, I think that there for some people that might be the right way to go is maybe take a month or two of just tracking and just looking and saying, oh yeah, I this is how much I am spending on this this category or or this place, right? And just kind of noticing things. And then you'll be in a better place to actually start making the plan and planning ahead as well.
Nikki Kinzer
Well and having better estimates, right? Like because if you're thinking about this is the money I have until I get paid next
Ben Barlowe
Right, yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
but I can't uh I don't have enough money to pay my whole rent right now, but I can put, you know, $300 in it. Right. So I think it just gives you a better idea of how much to put away in each category too.
Ben Barlowe
Right, right. Yeah, so that's a that's a good tip too.
Pete Wright
The town.
Nikki Kinzer
And it also you can see how much you're eating out. Oh my god, DoorDash is killing me.
Ben Barlowe
It's always it always comes back to dining out.
Nikki Kinzer
Dwar Josh is killing me.
Ben Barlowe
Like everyone you e it it's almost like annoying actually.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah. Yes.
Ben Barlowe
I've talked to so many people, like how did you get out of debt? Like what Like what you know what what what you made this you you went on this huge vacation or you saved up for a card or paying cash. Like how did you do it? It's like every single one of them are like, oh I didn't I stopped dining out or I didn't do DoorDash so much.
Nikki Kinzer
Stop tiding out.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yep.
Ben Barlowe
And I'm just like, ah, like can we just get something else? Like But it's like it's true.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
It's crazy.
Ben Barlowe
Like that's the thing for so many people.
Nikki Kinzer
But you see it and you're like, okay, all right, I get it.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
This is but this see, Nikki, uh this this is what really bakes your noodle, right?
Nikki Kinzer
I'm the problem. Like.
Pete Wright
It's the fact that if you're doing DoorDash How many more times could you go out if you drove to the restaurant yourself?
Ben Barlowe
Oh my gosh. I can't even do DoorDash.
Nikki Kinzer
It's crazy. It's crazy.
Ben Barlowe
Like I I can't do it. Like I at a certain point I was just like I'm paying like three times the amount for this burrito at this it's it just like makes me mad.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yes. And then I'm tipping the Door Dasher because I don't want them to like do anything to my food.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
So I'm like, I have to
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. Or they're gonna like take a video of you and like put it in your like Yeah, I mean it's yeah it's wild
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
I have to dip them. It's crazy. Yeah.
Pete Wright
I I it It's extraordinary. Like that piece alone is just having the awareness. Like you can't take action if you don't have the awareness of what you're spending, right?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Well it it
Pete Wright
If you don't have that.
Ben Barlowe
And here's the deal, like you might be like, but I really like dining out, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Mm-hmm.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Then you should put more money to dining out. Like you should you should spend more on dining out, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Right.
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
But what I think what a lot of people realize is It's not like, oh, I'm a bad person and I shouldn't get DoorDash and oh blah blah blah. You know, it's not that. It's actually, you know what? I don't enjoy getting DoorDash as much as I enjoy going to Italy. You know what I mean?
Nikki Kinzer
Right, right, right.
Ben Barlowe
Like like doing something really cool with my money.
Pete Wright
Fair comparison. I would love to eat Italian food in Italy.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
In Italy.
Ben Barlowe
Maybe that right, right.
Pete Wright
That would be dope.
Ben Barlowe
But like, and I know that sounds like kind of pie in the sky, but like that's an example of like, okay.
Nikki Kinzer
No, I love that.
Pete Wright
No, I love that.
Ben Barlowe
Do I want to get DoorDash every night or do I want to do something really cool with my money that I actually enjoy? And you might realize if you if you cut back on the DoorDash. You actually don't enjoy it as much as you thought you did. And the result is that you can actually spend that money in a way that you actually do want instead of a way that in truth you don't really want. Right.
Pete Wright
I you just you just use words to something that I've I've experienced and didn't really realize it.
Nikki Kinzer
Well, and in my truth
Pete Wright
The number of times I put a category in place, I fully fund it, and when I get to the point to make the purchase, I second guess making the purchase in the first place.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, yeah. And that that happens that happens all day, every day, to so many people where it's just like, I because you don't really know if you can afford it.
Pete Wright
That actually happens all the time.
Ben Barlowe
You're like Like in in afford it is more than just like, do I have the money? It's like, is there something else that's more important hiding in the in the in the in the leaves?
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
You know what I mean?
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
It's gonna jump out of me. Right. And if you
Pete Wright
Right.
Ben Barlowe
But if you give every dollar job, you're gonna consider all those things. And so you can actually go and spend the money and and and not second guess it, not worry about it, because you know you've considered it. And and I think a lot of this is just getting it out of your head.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Because when I go, every time I spend money, I'm like, well, okay, I gotta think about, okay, so I got $400 in the checking account, but the electric bill's coming out in two days. So I gotta think about that. And it's like, get all that out of your head.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Just say, I thought about all that stuff, and so I can buy it.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
No worries. Don't think about it, right?
Pete Wright
This is uh Nikki, this is exactly what we talk about with getting the doing the core dump, right? Like doing the brain dump and getting all your tasks out of your head into your task management. Like Do that with your with all of the things that are randling around in your head with regard to your money in uh in YNAB and or or whatever tool you choose to do, but something money focused. And that really helps. helps clear the clutter, right? And so much of what we're trying to do is is decrease the noise and increase the signal.
Nikki Kinzer
Oh yeah.
Pete Wright
Uh I I I
Nikki Kinzer
Well, because I think that something with with when you're looking at your money, you may not like what you're seeing. But you need to see it because if you don't see it, then you're also under this impression that, oh, I can pay, I can pay that later or
Ben Barlowe
Yeah Right.
Nikki Kinzer
Like right, that's where we get into the credit card debt, you know, issue and stuff. So I I think it's one of those things that you have to kind of face the fear because it's better to know than I think not to know and then get yourself in more trouble.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, I uh it's it's like this monster's chasing you and You you're imagining in it, it's like this big, toothy, hairy thing, and you're so scared. And sometimes I think if you just turn around, you face that monster, you find out it's like a it's a bunny rabbit. Like it's not
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
It's not actually that bad.
Pete Wright
It's not actually that bad.
Ben Barlowe
Other times it might actually be bad, you know, but like but you are a knight and you have a you have a sword and a shield and like you can you can slay that monster, but you gotta turn and face it, right?
Nikki Kinzer
Right, right.
Pete Wright
Mm-hmm.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
Best practices in terms of people visiting their budgets I I imagine you guys just leave it open all day long every day just as sort of a budgeting fever dream
Ben Barlowe
I I I do it too I do it too much, Pete. Like like you know, the point is to get out of my head, but I just can't stop looking at it, you know?
Nikki Kinzer
I don't know.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
But yeah, uh Ernie, you want to talk about that?
Nikki Kinzer
I promise you.
Ben Barlowe
Because you have a whole you have a workshop. you do about about routines, right?
Ernie Reppe
Well, we don't do that workshop anymore, but we we talk about routines all the time.
Ben Barlowe
Oh, okay, okay. Absolutely.
Pete Wright
It went out with age of money, just through the eye.
Ernie Reppe
And I think
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, exactly.
Ernie Reppe
I I think the easiest thing is just to get in there every single day because you're doing a little bit instead of a lot.
Nikki Kinzer
Well, right.
Ernie Reppe
I can handle categorizing two transactions from the day before.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
But if I wait a week or two weeks looking at 25 transactions, like no way.
Pete Wright
But if I went over
Nikki Kinzer
Not too much
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, like you don't know how much you what what category did you spend on Target three weeks ago?
Ernie Reppe
Right. I and I went to Target twelve times, so it there's a yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Like you
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Right, right.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
So yeah, if you do a little every day, uh it's it's I it's kinda like the dishes, which I don't really I I hate to to an analogize d doing doing the wine apping like the dishes because Yeah, the dishes at the worst, but th this is actually fun for me anyway. But but it's like, you know, if you let it pile up, it it gets kind of stinky, you know what I mean? But if you just do a little every day It's super easy. Oh, maybe maybe even joyful, maybe even a little fun, because you're kind of sorting you're uh kind of sorting it out, right?
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
But I would say like As far as like the processing of the transactions, no more than once a week, uh or no less than once a week.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And especially when you first get started, if you could do a little every day, I think it's it's it's really helpful.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
And then I think it's always helpful, you know, because there's gonna be various seasons where you're thinking about your money a little bit differently, like at the end of the month.
Pete Wright
Um
Nikki Kinzer
That's great.
Ernie Reppe
Maybe you want to do a monthly review and kind of look back on what that previous month was, or maybe it's January 1st.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Ernie Reppe
And what are my goals? What are our goals for the new year? So, you know, for me, most of my time is day-to-day. But then I'll step back every month and look at some stuff. I'll do a yearly review. And then every so often, you know, life just drastically changes. And I think those are great opportunities to just maybe start completely from scratch, you know, throw everything on the table and just redo everything.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
Wow.
Ben Barlowe
And then and then of course every time you get paid, that's that that'll be that'll be determined by your pay cycle. So if you get paid every two weeks, every two weeks You're gonna sit down and you're gonna give every dollar a job. You're gonna do that process of setting money aside into categories. And that gets super quick as you get more dialed in with what you want to do. Um, but that is really the bread and butter because that's where you're making those trade-offs decisions. And then every day you're processing and checking those categories just making sure that you're you're on track. That's really all there is to it.
Nikki Kinzer
I have to add, as an entrepreneur, um if you're getting paid not on a regular basis
Pete Wright
I have a remote. I get remote ones.
Nikki Kinzer
It w something I've learned in the last few years is, you know, I have that little account that's just for taxes So every time that I get paid, I put a percentage into that savings account.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, exactly.
Nikki Kinzer
I didn't I didn't do that for a while, for a long time. And boy, when that tax bill came, I was like What, yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, I mean that's that's that's one of those larger, less frequent expenses.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
But for you it's it's enormous because you don't you don't have somebody you don't have somebody withholding for you.
Pete Wright
Doing it for you.
Ben Barlowe
You have to do it yourself, right?
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, but that was one of the smartest things I've done. Every time I have something come in, I just take a percentage and it goes straight there. So now it feels like it's that joy that you're talking about, Ben. when you, you know, call the mechanic and it's like, yeah, I'm calling the tax guy and I've got the money.
Pete Wright
Yeah,
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. It doesn't feel good.
Pete Wright
Mm-hmm.
Ben Barlowe
Ma tax person actually likes you.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Pete Wright
I I actually like to go to the IRS with one of those like conference money guns that you see in hip hop videos.
Ben Barlowe
Yes.
Pete Wright
And I just point it and I just pay the bill in one one dollar bills, just shooting um making it literally rain uh in money.
Ben Barlowe
I I think I I I I think your tax person does not like you, Pete, if you do that.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Pete Wright
I love it.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah, no
Pete Wright
We're not we're not great friends, but we understand each other.
Nikki Kinzer
You're not watching Star Trek together.
Ben Barlowe
But well he gets it.
Pete Wright
Uh yeah. R watching Star Trek together.
Ben Barlowe
He gets Is he not on the group chat?
Pete Wright
He's not on the group chat, no way
Nikki Kinzer
No.
Pete Wright
Um uh okay, uh what is the for for just just as we get to wrap up, what is the most extravagant budget you've ever seen?
Ben Barlowe
Oh man Oh
Pete Wright
the most extravagant plan. I I want to give people the idea of the scope of what you can do in YNAB
Ben Barlowe
Yeah. Well, it's funny, w we have one episode called like a high income earner, like why not with a high end income person? And we we got somebody who was like who was fancy rich to come in and and talk with us.
Pete Wright
Fancy rich.
Ben Barlowe
Right. So if you want to see an example of because they went through their categories and showed numbers like everything.
Pete Wright
Yeah. Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Nikki Kinzer
Ooh, put that in the show note uh in the show notes.
Ben Barlowe
Uh Yeah, that was a f that was a couple years ago.
Nikki Kinzer
I want to listen to that. To aspire.
Ben Barlowe
That was yeah, that was that was great.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
But that that's it, but it really shows like It it doesn't matter your income level. Like there's some folks that are are really close to the edge and they need wine up, but there's folks that have extravagant incomes and they need wine up too because it it doesn't really matter that.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Ray wanna stay fancy rich, but like you know, the the the second guessing, the worry that Pete was talking about earlier, it happens to folks with with high incomes too.
Pete Wright
Yeah, you don't have to find it.
Ben Barlowe
It's just a whole different um it's a whole different set of numbers, but it we all worry about money.
Nikki Kinzer
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
And so it it it does happen. So I think you know it doesn't really matter your income level, really. It can be useful no matter what where you are.
Pete Wright
I delight in my category structure. It's one of the things I'm most proud of in my life. And I have children. Um I I have created categories for everything. Uh it is one of my babies. Even the smallest. I have an app that I pay $2. 99 a year for for a subscription. I have a category, but wait, but wait, I did.
Ernie Reppe
Thirty eight cents a month
Pete Wright
I I set up the a monthly um I I set up the monthly thing. So it actually contributes to that category like 30 cents a month.
Ben Barlowe
Oh, I love it.
Pete Wright
And so I
Ben Barlowe
I love it.
Pete Wright
Uh right? I mean I I delight in that experience. I delight in those little bars.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah.
Pete Wright
And I've never delighted about anything like this in my life.
Ben Barlowe
It's just fun.
Pete Wright
It yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Like, because you don't want to have to worry about finding three dollars when the expense comes around.
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
Like
Pete Wright
Yeah.
Ben Barlowe
It gets that like okay, some of you guys are listening if you're like, really, Pete? Like I I do like you don't have to get that detail, but like you can if you want.
Nikki Kinzer
You can't
Ben Barlowe
And if you if that sounds if that gives you life, then do it, you know.
Pete Wright
You can It does. It gives me life. That's what it gives me.
Ben Barlowe
Right.
Pete Wright
I love it so, so much. I um uh you oh I don't even know where to begin to tell people to go subscribe to the show. I love it so much because it gives me not just ideas about how to use YNEB, but uh uh it's sort of a role model for how to think about money and how to think about my expenses. You guys are doing great, great work. And uh we're just huge fans of YNAB.
Ben Barlowe
Thank you.
Nikki Kinzer
C R
Pete Wright
Thank you so much for hanging out with us uh today and sharing with the the community and and And hopefully your current users and future users who are among us. Um it's a great tool for ADHD.
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, this is a blast.
Pete Wright
Yeah. So Where where do you want to send people? I mean if you want to send we'll put the link to budget nerds in there, but what what uh anything specific we haven't mentioned that you want to make sure we send people to look at?
Ben Barlowe
Yeah, I'd say if you want to try a trial of the Wine App software, Go to whynabynab. com slash nerds. That'll uh let us know that that uh we sent you. So and you'll get a free 34-day trial there.
Pete Wright
Excellent.
Ben Barlowe
Um and that'll be a good way to just get started and we'll start sending you. Well, yeah, don't worry. We'll send you all sorts of goodies along the way to teach you. And yeah, if you want to go to our YouTube channel, that's a good place you can.
Pete Wright
Yeah. What is that?
Ben Barlowe
subscribe there and you'll see all of our our podcasts on video form there but you'll also see some getting started videos there and that's a good place to go
Nikki Kinzer
Awesome.
Pete Wright
Perfect.
Nikki Kinzer
Thank you so much.
Pete Wright
Perfect. You guys are great. Thank you so much. And to everybody listening, thank you for downloading and listening to this show. Thank you for your time and your attention. Don't forget if you have something to contribute to the conversation, we're heading over to the Show Talk channel over in Discord, and you can join us right there by becoming a supporting member at the deluxe level or better. Patreon. com slash the ADHD. Podcast. On behalf of Ben Barlow, Ernie Rappi, Nikki Kinzer, I'm Pete Wright. And we'll see you next week right here on Taking Control, the ADHD podcast.